Next session as poker becomes "second job."
After work, the next casino in my rotation was Bellagio. I go in to play 4/8, and was treated poorly yet again. I told the brush that I wanted 4/8, she didn't make eye contact with me, and just pointed at a game and said "Right there." So, I go get my own cheques, and the cashier didn't say a word.
I was surprised that the game only had 6 players. 2 were very weak, and I got up about $30 quickly. Then, the fish left and it was only 5 handed. I'm not a big fan short handed, so I called MGM to see if they had a 4/8 game. They told me they had one that was 7 handed, so I decided to rack up after 20 minutes. Got sucked out on in my last round and finished Bellagio down $8. As I cashed out, cashier totally ignored me again.
I got to MGM, and the 4-8 game just broke! I asked the floor what happened, and he said 3 players left and the other 4 went to 2/4. I wasn't planning on playing NL, but I checked out the game and felt it was worth a shot. Two guys were drunk and one guy with $700 was falling asleep.
I bought in for $150. Couple of rounds into it, I get AQ, flop a Q, somehow got all in and doubled up against KQ. A few hands later, I get AJ, flop J, get all in against a player that just seemed like he wanted to leave, he had J-10. Within the first 4 rounds, I already tripled up.
Went a couple of hours without a real pot, missed a lot of draws, and was down to $200. Had JJ, flop AA8, I check, lone opponent goes all in for $180, and decided to fold. Tough hands.
UTG, I get AQo, so I raised to $8. Got 4 callers. Flop was AAJ, so I bet $25. SB calls (he had about 180, I had about 275.) Turn was 2, I bet $50, SB calls. River was 2, SB bets $25, I go all in, and he calls with A-10. That sucked.
Next round, I was one of the button. One player with $700+ raises to $6 from UTG+1. Two people call, I call with 67o, and I had $300. Button (guy who was falling asleep and down to $200) calls. He played a lot of hands, and pushed a lot with draws. BB calls, $30 pot.
Flop 4d6s7s, BB checks, Pre-flop raiser checks, next player bets $10, I raise to $50, button goes all in for a total of $200.
First, what would you do? I'm fairly new to NL, so I'm not sure if I made the right play.
(think, think, think...)
I called, fairly quickly. Thought he was on a spade draw, or had a 5 for draw. Didn't think he would call PF with 5-8 or 3-5. Longshot that he had flopped set.
He had 5-8s.
Turn = 6!!!!!
I didn't even see his hand 'til the river. I tapped the felt in a psuedo-poker apology and raked the pot, and tossed the dealer $10.
To those of you with more NL experience, did I misplay this hand? PF maybe was a little loose, but if I didn't nail the flop, I was gone. Was the flop all-in call risky?
Played one more round, was getting tired, and decided to quit +340 with a little over 3 hours of play.
On my way out, I tipped to floor that told me the 4/8 game was going $10.
Nice report.
For an additional $150, I would easily insta call in your spot with top two.
OESD,FD often push in this situation, and you are still drawing live even if they flopped the nut straight.
I also have no problem with your PF call considering the action ahead of you, amount of the raise, and most importantly, position.
I am not sure why you would even have given Bellagio the time of day anyway. Unless seeking a mid or high limit game, there is simply NO good reason to play there. Better service, comfort, and action is found elsewhere, easily.
If you are interested in playing 4/8 in a comperably big room, play at Venetian. 4/8 runs 24/7, and the staff/comfort is phencomenal, even if the players are generally better overall then at most other places (though easily comperable to those found at Bellagio).
Nice Report.
Not to disagree with Michael, but for another perspective ...
Considering the preflop raise was only to $8, there probably aren't any two cards (including 72o) that I wouldn't expect someone to call with to see a flop. IE. you called with 67o. Without any other tells or takes on the other player, I would immediately figure the all in guy for at least a set.
I would have mucked the hand - I'm betting $150 to win $230 of which $58 is mine. You're getting not quite 1 to 1.5. At best you're 50-50 vs a good draw like As5s. You're a 2-1 dog to a straight and more than a 4-1 dog to a set of 4's.
I guess it boils down to how often you think you're opponent would make that bet with less than a set (a worst two pr, top pr with A kicker, or an over pr etc.) My guess is that over time it's at best a break even proposition.
In my experience people (who know what they're doing) generally don't push all their chips in without having at least 2pr. Knowing my opponent would certainly be the deciding factor in my calling or not.
Glad that it worked out for you this time!
@NoRunnerRunner
Please, feel free to disagree as much as you want! That is the point of an internet board discussion (to discuss different opinions on the play of the hand).
Though I respect your different perspective of the play, I have to wholly disagree with the above statement.
There are MANY bad players in baby NL games (in fact, I would go so far as to say that most are pretty bad, especially in Vegas). Pushing with top pair is VERY common (even without an Ace kicker). Maybe on the internet, I would recommend throwing it away, but in a live game, I firmly believe that this is an all in situation, with a very high chance being that you do indeed have the best hand.
I realize that your parenthetical notation mentions that the assumption that the players who know what they are doing generally don't do it, and that may be true, but many times, good players will still make this move, for a variety of reasons.
Nice report, thanks!
I have to agree there. Online I'd be throwing this away. But in a live game I'm going to really think about staying in and pushing. There are so many bad-drunk-touristyneverplayedbutsawitonESPN players in b&m games, if they have any part of the hand they are likely to push all in. Against these folk, two pair are gold, especially on this flop.
I'm not sure we really disagree.
One of the first things I do when I sit down at a table is figure out who the players are who overvalue top pr. If the person pushing all in was one of those I'd call in a heartbeat. But I don't think (for my earlier reasons) that it's a good call to make unless you have reason to believe that he'd push with less than 2pr. In fact, in this specific case the call was actually wrong (and he got it in with way the worst of it) but was lucky to suck out.
I play mostly online (baby - .50-1, 1-2 NL games) and you definately don't make that call often there. Maybe as I get to play more live action in Vegas this year my perspective will loosen up
@NoRunnerRunner
Don't mean to hijack this thread but where are ppl playing online poker these days. Im a party poker/poker stars refugee.
After being kicked off of PartyPoker, I've been playing PokerStars and BoDog. With Netteller dying I don't know how I'll reload PokerStars if I need to - hopefully I won't. I believe that BoDog took my money directly without needing a 3rd party.
As far as On-Line, I'm not a huge fan but I do play occasionally. I used to split my time with Party Poker and Absolute. Now I just play Absolute. DAMN GOVERNMENT!
@I_Flopped_It
Full Tilt is easily the best as far as i'm concerned.
BoDog also changed the way they take money. I used to do it straight through a "poker" bank account I set up. They stopped doing that last month. When I withdrew money in Feb., they had to send me a check. It was pretty cool cashing a $1mil check, though
.
I now play at FullTilt, but you also have to use a 'middle-merchant' to fund the account. I am using mywebatm. I actually have an atm card, and I can make purchases online (or fund this poker site). I haven't tried to get money out, though. I'm actually heading over to the bank this afternoon to try that for the first time.